Oh for God's sake, not another buffers thread!

[Fleabiscuit]

Just wondering what y'all are using in the way of buffers, if you're using them at all. Now that I've got this HUUUUUUUGE new home board with about a mile of cable run, I'm thinking it wouldn't hurt to use one. But is this true? I almost never play 100% clean, direct into the amp, no boost or OD pedals running. I'm also a bit reluctant to pop for something like Lovepedal's little line driver/buffer unit that doesn't also act as a boost or whatever. Based on appearance the MI Boost N' Buff is out; I'm pondering the Durham Sex Drive, but it's pricey AND I've already got about six really good boost pedals. Are their good buffers in other effects? Particularly mod effects (phasers, etc.), which I don't already have a ton of?

[rologibson]

Tone topics are a sort of passion for me.(self note: scales I need to work on my scales..)

I would just suggest an attack plan otherwise you could loose a valuable opportunity of throughly testing methodically your overall tone.

Before buying a buffer pedal for your board, you should tweak and test pedals vrs guitar going directly into amp. And rearrange pedal routes.

I believe that a good method is:to start by getting the best possible tone from your GUITAR AND AMP....how do you feel when you bend a note? How does the final notes ring on any given string? Do have enough sustain? Do lack bass, mid or treble?..Play with your ears open to feeling factor... are you being inspired by the sound? Carefull with the Gain it gives sustain but may kill your headroom tone... then move on to pedals knobs and tweaking.

A way to shorten the signal distance: get a true-bypass loop pedal to arrange pedals into loops therefore having them out of the signal path when desired.

i used to have a buffered pedal named Burris Boostier first in the signal chain on and just to boost my Axe signal.
My Burris is resting peacefully in the desk drawer because I went the long mile and re-tested my tone without it, my new Lyric cables made a big difference no need to buffer my signal these cables give a very strong signal to start with.


Just open your mind to testing and re-testing.. that is my main advise. Rock on! DO tell what happens in the end of your search. MErry Christmas, peace and love to all.

[Fleabiscuit]

Thanks, Rolo--sounds like a fun way to re-engage with gear!

I should mention that everything on my board right now is true bypass, but because of the number of pedals on this big-ass board (around 20 and counting) the total cable run is necessarily pretty lengthy from guitar to board, from pedal 1 to pedal 20, then from board to amp.

[rologibson]

Wow! 20 is quite a bit of tone-escapades

That avatar shows how you are stomping pedal No.20


I can not emphasize enough the benefits of drawing with a pencil on a blank piece of paper how you set your pedals on the board. It will make you come up with new pedal locations or combinations.

For Tone and Honor!!!!

[VanStone]

Being the curious type who loves to research I’ve done a fair amount of learning about gear over the last few years, but I must say “buffers” is a subject I haven’t even touched. So thanks to your question I went a Googling and found a few good articles:

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/document?doc_id=99397

http://www.gibson.com/en-us/Lifestyle/Features/Gibson%20Tone%20Tips_%20True%20Bypass/

http://www.muzique.com/lab/truebypass.htm

To summarize, there are advantages and disadvantages to both buffered and true bypass. But it looks to me like if you are going to go buffered, the best way to go is with a high quality buffer (inserted somewhere after fuzz and wah pedals). So I would probably go with something like the Wampler, Lovepedal, or Radial Big Shot.

With 20 pedals and 40 feet of cable you should probably consider a buffer. Although, one of those articles favors high quality cables and connectors instead.

Just a thought… Have you considered splitting that into two boards? Surely you don’t use all 20 pedals in a sitting. You could match them to your amps if you have more than one amp; or you could make a low-mid gain board and a mid-high gain board; or you could make a Strat/Tele board and a Humbucker board. I’m sure there are sensible ways to split out a couple of boards if you put some thought into it.

V

[Tone Dog]

Holy crap thats a big board, FleaB! Sheesh!

I used a couple of different buffers but never really heard any improvement in my sound to speak of so I quit messing with them. But it was probably because I only gig with a few pedals (maybe 3) and even if all are true bypass I don't suffer much signal loss with so few in my signal path. But with a board that size, I agree with VanStone and would suggest doing a little research and find a top-shelf buffer. I think it would payoff far more for you than it ever did for me.

[Glo®bz]

Like Tone Dog never been an issue for me...

Right now I have 2 pedals at the most... morley wah and empress paraEq.

Never had a lot on a board either I thing the most I had was something like 4.
Not counting switchers and other MIDI controller type of pedals otherwise I had a shit load going on in my crazy days...

Ohh and I never really had long cable runs... max I ever had was 40ft total 20ft between gtr/board and 20ft between board/amp if I needed more I'd usually use the wireless I had. Now I'm usually under 20ft total... I don't need to be as far anymore lol

[Fleabiscuit]

Van, all--I'm fully aware of the general goofy-ness of someone like me, a weekend jammer, putting 20 pedals on a single board and expecting anything like a practical result. I did the former, but don't expect the latter. The motherboard is really a way of displaying my little pedal collection, but at the same time getting them all off the shelf and out where I can play with them when the mood strikes. If I'm going to band practice or one of our little gigs somewhere, I'll pull off three or four, stick them on a small board and away we go. That said, if I'm going to do the motherboard (and it is totally fun, visually and sonically) I want it to sound and look as good as possible. So I think I'll try the little Lovepedal buffer and see if it makes a discernible difference--if not, back it goes.

[tjb0274]

For what you're doing, sounds like a dedicated buffer might be the go.

I have a Sex Drive, and the buffer is certainly good (less noticeable for e.g. than a std Boss pedal or Ibanez pedal) with only a couple of pedals. I've never used it with anything like the number of pedals/cable run that you've got, though!

From what I've read, you might need to think about two buffers - something at the beginning (after Wah and any germanium-based pedals) to reduce the tone suck on the pickups, and something at the end to get the impedance optimal for the amp. If you use any digital time-based pedals at the end of the chain, some of those (e.g. T-Rex, Nova) have good buffers as well.

[VanStone]

Originally Posted by Fleabiscuit

The motherboard is really a way of displaying my little pedal collection, but at the same time getting them all off the shelf and out where I can play with them when the mood strikes. If I'm going to band practice or one of our little gigs somewhere, I'll pull off three or four, stick them on a small board and away we go.

Ah, I see, makes sense. Let us know how the buffer works out.

BTW f you're still interested in slipping something in the modulation/delay section, I was just looking at this: http://malekkoekko616.com/. Which, besides looking like a really cool delay, can switch between buffered and true bypass with the press of a button. And they claim a high quality buffer.

V